TalkBaja.com » Baja Mexico Forums » General Discussion

This happened about nine months ago

My wife lives in Caborca Mexico. I travel from Phoenix to see her. I drive to Sonoyta Sonora then to Caborca to see her. The bridge in Sonoyta Mexico had been out for several months for repair. They had a detour path around the bridge so traffic could continue. Due to monsoon season alot of rain was occuring and on several other visits I had to wait for the bypass to clear of water.

On one visit the water was so bad that they said it would be several hours before crossing would be possible. The rains were being collected in a small lake just east of the city so work on the bridge could continue. But because of so many storms that summer the lake was full and water had to be let out of the lake. Traffic was backed up bad as people go to Rocky Point this time of year. Large trucks could get through but not cars.

So the industrious Mexicans had flat bed hauling trucks charging $20 to take your car to the other side. I was leery but said OK. I rode in the truck with the driver. No problems. It was so funny. The locals were having a fiesta. They were lined up at the temporary crossing with coolers of beer, eating tacos, and playing their borracho music watching the trucks ferry the gringos across the river. They would cheer and hoot and howl as each vehicle started across. No problem and I made it OK.

About two weeks later I made another trip down and this time they said it would be 24 hours before crossing was available because there had been so much rain that week they had to continually let water out of the lake. This time it was so bad not even large trucks could not make it. I waited 3 hours and it was bad. So I had two choices. Drive to San Luis and take the backroads which would take 6 hours. Or drive to Nogales and then to Caborca which would take 4 hours.

I decided on Nogales. I called the wife and told her. It had been 8 years since I have been to Nogales. So I headed to Tucson. I got about 35 miles from Tucson and needed a map as I did not know the best route to the border. I stopped at a gas station and asked the the attendant the best way to Tucson to cross the border to Nogales. I told her I need to go to Caborca. She said why do that. She stated to take the road that headed south at that very intersection and it would take you to the border crossing at Sasabe.

I asked her if it was a crossing that had car passage and she said yes. Looked at the map and sure enough it would save about 40 miles in all. So I headed south about 25 miles and there was a s(m)all grocery store just before crossing the border. I walked in and asked about the road that went into Mexico. The lady showed me a map and told me what road to take out of town. It was pretty easy as there are only two. Stay to the road that veers left. I asked her the condition of the road and she stated not too bad and that 70 % was good pavement and you could safely drive 55.

The length of the road from Sasabe to Saric was about 35 miles. I thought OK not bad. I crossed the border and hit the Y in the road and took the one to the left. Not bad. The next 10 miles was real nice. Then the road pavement went away and got a little bad for the next 5 miles and I thought not too good but it was doable. The next 5 miles and the road got continually worse. I had seen no cars. I started to think about turning back. But I said nope I am not going all the way back. I would now lose 2 1/2 hours. So I continue and the road now turned into a goat trail.

I figured I had about 10 miles. I continued and went to a point where there was a bend in the road. As I got to the end of the bend I saw about 40 Yards away a blue pick up truck and two men with what looked like AK-47's standing in the middle of the road . They put their hands up with the stop signal. I said WTF. These are NOT the federalies The truck was not a government truck nor were they dressed in military uniforms. I thought if I stop they will at a minimum rob me or maybe kill me also.

I had a choice to make. I slowed down to make them think I was going to stop. When I got within 15 yards I gun(n)ed the car and went around them. They raised their guns and put a bead on me. There was another person in the truck and he picked them up. I thought I am going to die in this miserable place. No turning back now. I had maybe a 150 yard jump on them. My little Kia was all over the place. They were gaining fast. Never heard a shot but was waiting. They continued to gain and I thought I am for sure f***ed.

When they were about 20 yards behind me the road turned to pavement. I then kept weaving to prevent them from passing and to prevent them from getting a good shot at me. My little Kia was too quick for them and after about 1 1/2 miles they went back. Four more miles and I was in Saric. About another mile I saw 2 truck loads of federalies parked. I told them what happened. They asked me what type of truck and what were they wearing. They raidioed and both trucks of four took off.

I got to Caborca and told my wife. She said Saric was very dangerous. She stated that the Zetas controlled the area and it was the area in that region where drugs and people are smuggled across the border. It is very remote. She stated that the year before when it rained very hard that many bodies floated up and were found in the arroyos. I later read that about 5 years ago there was a major battle between the Zetas and the Sinaloa cartels in that area. The report said 20 were killed but many believe that was not true and as many as 50 were killed in the gun battle.

So I made a poor decision. I believed the lady in the store on the American side. I should have turned around when it was bad and had seen no cars. The moral of the story. Dont go anywhere unless you know for sure and stop when things dont look good And never be a dumb ass

Originally Posted by Amigo Arizona

This happened about nine months ago
My wife lives in Caborca Mexico. I travel from Phoenix to see her. I drive to Sonoyta Sonora then to Caborca to see her. The bridge in Sonoyta Mexico had been out for several months for repair. They had a detour path around the bridge so traffic could continue. Due to monsoon season alot of rain was occuring and on several other visits I had to wait for the bypass to clear of water. On one visit the water was so bad that they said it would be several hours before crossing would be possible. The rains were being collected in a small lake just east of the city so work on the bridge could continue. But because of so many storms that summer the lake was full and water had to be let out of the lake. Traffic was backed up bad as people go to Rocky Point this time of year. Large trucks could get through but not cars. So the industrious Mexicans had flat bed hauling trucks charging $20 to take your car to the other side. I was leery but said OK. I rode in the truck with the driver. No problems. It was so funny. The locals were having a fiesta. They were lined up at the temporary crossing with coolers of beer, eating tacos, and playing their borracho music watching the trucks ferry the gringos across the river. They would cheer and hoot and howl as each vehicle started across. No problem and I made it OK.
About two weeks later I made another trip down and this time they said it would be 24 hours before crossing was available because there had been so much rain that week they had to continually let water out of the lake. This time it was so bad not even large trucks could not make it. I waited 3 hours and it was bad. So I had two choices. Drive to San Luis and take the backroads which would take 6 hours. Or drive to Nogales and then to Caborca which would take 4 hours. I decided on Nogales. I called the wife and told her. It had been 8 years since I have been to Nogales. So I headed to Tucson. I got about 35 miles from Tucson and needed a map as I did not know the best route to the border. I stopped at a gas station and asked the the attendant the best way to Tucson to cross the border to Nogales. I told her I need to go to Caborca. She said why do that. She stated to take the road that headed south at that very intersection and it would take you to the border crossing at Sasabe. I asked her if it was a crossing that had car passage and she said yes. Looked at the map and sure enough it would save about 40 miles in all. So I headed south about 25 miles and there was a sall grocery store just before crossing the border. I walked in and asked about the road that went into Mexico. The lady showed me a map and told me what road to take out of town. It was pretty easy as there are only two. Stay to the road that veers left. I asked her the condition of the road and she stated not too bad and that 70 % was good pavement and you could safely drive 55. The length of the road from Sasabe to Saric was about 35 miles. I thought OK not bad. I crossed the border and hit the Y in the road and took the one to the left. Not bad. The next 10 miles was real nice. Then the road pavement went away and got a little bad for the next 5 miles and I thought not too good but it was doable. The next 5 miles and the road got continually worse. I had seen no cars. I started to think about turning back. But I said nope I am not going all the way back. I would now lose 2 1/2 hours. So I continue and the road now turned into a goat trail. I figured I had about 10 miles. I continued and went to a point where there was a bend in the road. As I got to the end of the bend I saw about 40 Yards away a blue pick up truck and two men with what looked like AK-47's standing in the middle of the road . They put their hands up with the stop signal. I said WTF. These are NOT the federalies The truck was not a government truck nor were they dressed in military uniforms. I thought if I stop they will at a minimum rob me or maybe kill me also. I had a choice to make. I slowed down to make them think I was going to stop. When I got within 15 yards I guned the car and went around them. They raised their guns and put a bead on me. There was another person in the tuck and he picked them up. I thought I am going to die in this miserable place. No turning back now. I had maybe a 150 yard jump on them. My little Kia was all over the place. They were gaining fast. Never heard a shot but was waiting. They continued to gain and I thought I am for sure f***ed. When they were about 20 yards behind me the road turned to pavement. I then kept weaving to prevent them from passing and to prevent them from getting a good shot at me. My little Kia was too quick for them and after about 1 1/2 miles they went back. Four more miles and I was in Saric. About another mile I saw 2 truck loads of federalies parked. I told them what happened. They asked me what type of truck and what were they wearing. They raidioed and both trucks of four took off.
I got to Caborca and told my wife. She said Saric was very dangerous. She stated that the Zetas controlled the area and it was the area in that region where drugs and people are smuggled across the border. It is very remote. She stated that the year before when it rained very hard that many bodies floated up and were found in the arroyos. I later read that about 5 years ago there was a major battle between the Zetas and the Sinaloa cartels in that area. The report said 20 were killed but many believe that was not true and as many as 50 were killed in the gun battle.
So I made a poor decision. I believed the lady in the store on the American side. I should have turned around when it was bad and had seen no cars. The moral of the story. Dont go anywhere unless you know for sure and stop when things dont look good And never be a dumb ass

Now that was a scary experience. Too bad no Go Pro video. We experienced an armed carjack attempt in TJ once- but nothing like what you went through. Unfriggingbelienvable. Very glad you are alive to tell the story. I don't think most people know how genuinely bad things are and how quickly they can go from bad to worse to tragic.

I know people who routinely drive in Mexico on US and Canadian plates with absolutely no problem.

So, as my wife and I are planning to drive to Mazatlan in November, stories like this make me extremely nervous.

To drive or no drive?

Recommendations?

Originally Posted by sargentodiaz

I know people who routinely drive in Mexico on US and Canadian plates with absolutely no problem.

So, as my wife and I are planning to drive to Mazatlan in November, stories like this make me extremely nervous.

To drive or no drive?

Recommendations?

I was afraid that I would get a response like this if I told my story. I have been going to Mexico for over 9 years now and this is the first time. If you stay on the main roads and drive at daytime I see no problems. What happened to me was my fault. This road is very remote. Like I said alot of it was like a goat trail. Before you take your trip get info about where you are going and where to stay away from. You can contact the state department. Here is an excellent website provided by the state department. Smart Traveler Enrollment Program (STEP)
Here is another good website. Mexico Travel Safety Tips - Safe Travel in Mexico - Tips for Mexico Travel Safety Also call a travel agency. They may be able to give you some good info also. Please do not let this story ruin or make you change your mind. What I did was dumb. I have a friend who has a home in Matzalan and he drives there all the time.

Another good source of information correspondencia@sectur.gob.mx

Originally Posted by Amigo Arizona

Another good source of information correspondencia@sectur.gob.mx

I think that's an email address.

Originally Posted by DENNIS

I think that's an email address.

LOL yes it is Dennis

Originally Posted by Amigo Arizona

I was afraid that I would get a response like this if I told my story. I have been going to Mexico for over 9 years now and this is the first time. If you stay on the main roads and drive at daytime I see no problems. What happened to me was my fault. This road is very remote. Like I said alot of it was like a goat trail. Before you take your trip get info about where you are going and where to stay away from. You can contact the state department. Here is an excellent website provided by the state department. Smart Traveler Enrollment Program (STEP)
Here is another good website. Mexico Travel Safety Tips - Safe Travel in Mexico - Tips for Mexico Travel Safety Also call a travel agency. They may be able to give you some good info also. Please do not let this story ruin or make you change your mind. What I did was dumb. I have a friend who has a home in Matzalan and he drives there all the time.

We've all made wrong turns taking a "shortcut" and been too stubborn to go back. We know the drug traffickers are out there, but rarely do we interact with them on their turf. I think that is why the US State department says to keep your heads up at all times and be aware of everything happening around you. You kept your wits about you and shared a valuable story.

Thanks for sharing your story. I've always stayed on paved roads in well populated areas and I've only been exploring Baja since the Drug War began. So, security has always been a concern and I've wondered when I'd meet a narco. . . .. Anyways, your story is valuable in that it shows:

1) You were in the middle of nowhere when it happened. Seriously, it sounds like you were in an area no 'normal' (whatever that is) person would be in. In other words, it didn't happen just outside of a large (or small) population center.

2) You were able to evade them in a Kia. I mean, really? WTH? They were either A) unmotivated B) stoned, drunk, whatever C) didn't know how to drive D) about to run out of gas E) had no ammunition F) weren't allowed to leave their post without permission G) no match for your flame painted, limited slip differential, turbo-charged, cold air inducted Kia or H) intimidated by your appearance.

3) You admit your poor judgement. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to pile-on. Just want to say that you saw multiple ways in which other decisions along the way would have avoided this situation. Many people may read this as a blanket condemnation of all roads in Mexico or even the entire country and you've already stated that this should not the case.

Originally Posted by Woooosh

We experienced an armed carjack attempt in TJ once- but nothing like what you went through.

Woooosh, do you mind sharing what happened? If you have already done so, could you post a link?

Originally Posted by bwall

Thanks for sharing your story. I've always stayed on paved roads in well populated areas and I've only been exploring Baja since the Drug War began. So, security has always been a concern and I've wondered when I'd meet a narco. . . .. Anyways, your story is valuable in that it shows:

1) You were in the middle of nowhere when it happened. Seriously, it sounds like you were in an area no 'normal' (whatever that is) person would be in. In other words, it didn't happen just outside of a large (or small) population center.

2) You were able to evade them in a Kia. I mean, really? WTH? They were either A) unmotivated B) stoned, drunk, whatever C) didn't know how to drive D) about to run out of gas E) had no ammunition F) weren't allowed to leave their post without permission G) no match for your flame painted, limited slip differential, turbo-charged, cold air inducted Kia or H) intimidated by your appearance.

3) You admit your poor judgement. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to pile-on. Just want to say that you saw multiple ways in which other decisions along the way would have avoided this situation. Many people may read this as a blanket condemnation of all roads in Mexico or even the entire country and you've already stated that this should not the case.

The reason I think they did not fire a shot was because they did not want any noise. I think they felt they would just stop me nice and quiet. Then I think they thought they could overtake me before I got to the paved road. Once on the paved road it was only 4 miles to a small town and more people They did not want to fire their guns. I wonder how many other times they have done this. The road runs in the low area and there are higher hills. Maybe a lookout saw me comming and raidioed to them. Yes I was scared bad and the hair on my neck stood up just waiting for a shot.
When I visited the next time and got to Sonoyta the river was OK. But I called my wife and said the river was running so I would cross at Sasabe again. She almost had a cow. I told her the word was out to the Zeta cartel to not mess with the crazy gringo in the red KIA

Originally Posted by bwall

Woooosh, do you mind sharing what happened? If you have already done so, could you post a link?

sure, but keep in mind it was a different lawless time in TJ and there was danger for people driving the toll road. It's a different type of danger these days.

BajaNomad Forums - "Peace, Love & Fish Tacos"

Originally Posted by Woooosh

it was a different lawless time in TJ

It sure was. The toll road after sunset was really dangerous.

Interesting read. Thanks for posting.

In late 2009 I saw some business opportunities in Mexico and used Baja as my base of operations. I drove the TJ-Ensenada toll road about one a month or so, occassionally at night. I always felt safe, but I certainly did breathe a big sigh of relief when I read that Teo and his gang got rolled up.

In your opinion, what was the biggest catalyst for the change that makes the area safer:
"it was a different lawless time in TJ and there was danger for people driving the toll road" ?

Originally Posted by bwall

Interesting read. Thanks for posting.


In your opinion, what was the biggest catalyst for the change that makes the area safer:
"it was a different lawless time in TJ and there was danger for people driving the toll road" ?

Regardless of the personnel committing the crimes, these weren't cartel activities and the police agencies came down on those who were hurting tourism. When law enforcement wants to work, they can be very effective.
Another thing.........these toll road events were taking place before the military had such a heavy presence on the roads. That changed a lot.
It seems as though they're scaling back their operations so we just have to wait and see how brazen the scum can get.
What with the cartels doing much the same, they have turned loose a lot of bad guys with nothing to do. It could be a problem.

Originally Posted by DENNIS

Regardless of the personnel committing the crimes, these weren't cartel activities and the police agencies came down on those who were hurting tourism. When law enforcement wants to work, they can be very effective.
Another thing.........these toll road events were taking place before the military had such a heavy presence on the roads. That changed a lot.
It seems as though they're scaling back their operations so we just have to wait and see how brazen the scum can get.
What with the cartels doing much the same, they have turned loose a lot of bad guys with nothing to do. It could be a problem.

I agree with Dennis. I don't recall anyone ever saying "it's safer now", It just was. At the time the media (especially the SDUT) was busy denying there was any violence taking place in Baja. They weren't putting the executions and grizzly El Teo stories out there. It's hard to tell when it got safer and why. Baja had it's head in the sand the whole time. Once it was over they pulled it out and said "what did I miss? and went on like nothing had happened (only no one followed). It was only after the crime wave was over that Baja finally mentioned it was real and had an effect on the economy and tourism. Before then they had blamed the swine flu and NOB media.

fyi- The State Department travel advisory still says not to drive at night. The narcos own the night.

Originally Posted by Woooosh

I don't recall anyone ever saying "it's safer now", It just was.

"Trouble" was almost expected if one was to drive the toll road at night. I had a neighbor, Linda, who headed to the states one night and somewhere near BajaMar they tried to pull her over. She drove a nice little sports car and she was a woman alone....a soft target...until one of the bad guys pulled ahead of her, stopped and got out of his vehicle waving a pistol.
Too bad for that a-hole. Linda went right at him, sideswiping the vehicle and almost center punching the jerk in the road.
She says she's not sure what happened to him, but she didn't let up on the gas and they didn't come after her.
My kinda lady.

Originally Posted by DENNIS

"Trouble" was almost expected if one was to drive the toll road at night. I had a neighbor, Linda, who headed to the states one night and somewhere near BajaMar they tried to pull her over. She drove a nice little sports car and she was a woman alone....a soft target...until one of the bad guys pulled ahead of her, stopped and got out of his vehicle waving a pistol.
Too bad for that a-hole. Linda went right at him, sideswiping the vehicle and almost center punching the jerk in the road.
She says she's not sure what happened to him, but she didn't let up on the gas and they didn't come after her.
My kinda lady.

It was very bad for a few years. The bad guys had strobe lights and uniforms and counted on law-abiding tourist to pull lover. Eveyone should know you can legally continue to drive to the first safe place before stopping, any time someone who looks like police tries to pull you over.
Most the robberies were done using two cars- one to block. There were a couple of very nasty incidents, like the one involving the McMillin racing team. That set the Baja racing circuit back and I don't think it's ever been the same since.

This is a tad depressing. We learned a lot about Mexico, but nothing good.

Originally Posted by Woooosh

This is a tad depressing. We learned a lot about Mexico, but nothing good.

Impressing or depressing, not sure which, we learned the authorities can put a stop to it when the set out to do that.

Originally Posted by DENNIS

Impressing or depressing, not sure which, we learned the authorities can put a stop to it when the set out to do that.

It worked last time for us in Baja, but not for the country in general. We're all hoping for the same this time around, but we won't be hearing much about it. The talking points are the economy and tourism.