Building your Baja dream home Advice, photos and ideas...

Old 05-30-09, 09:41 PM   #1
longlegsinlapaz
 
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Default My TOP Pick in Construction Material

I swear FANOSA should consider hiring me as their paid spokesperson!!

I've built 3 casas here over the past 10 years. My first two were built using conventional cement block construction & both REQUIRED A/C. I researched foam block versus foam panel materials prior to my last construction & I decided on FANOSA foam block for several reasons: appreciably better insulation factor because of thickness for highest for insulation & sound barrier, requires thinner plaster inside & out compared to panel.

I understand that some might feel that the initial materials cost being a little higher than conventional cement block construction may be prohibitive....however, IMO, between the labor time saved, which actually equates to a twofold savings when you take Seguro Social into account as well; it reduces or eliminates the need for A/C equipment; it reduces or eliminates the electricity you'd be forced to use with A/C from day 1; it's my personal belief that the net result is an immediate cost savings/avoidance beginning the first day of construction & continued savings from that day forward. An added bonus for me was between the time I did my research & began my construction, FANOSA opened a manufacturing plant here in La Paz, thereby eliminating shipping costs from Hermosillo!

Foam blocks are approximately a meter long & 1 1/2 times the height of conventional cement block. This means that the construction goes MUCH more rapidly. As the following pics show, structural integrity is achieved with both rebar and a cement grid which is created by the vertical circular holes & horizontal trough that runs the length of each block. They install 1-2 rows of block in height & then pour a slurry of cement into the holes which fills both the vertical & horizontal spaces. All plumbing & electrical was installed as construction progressed....I'm rabidly opposed to chipping out later to install anything!!

They poured my footings, foundation & floors in one pour on August 10 & they poured the roof September 22. My interior living/garage space is 1,600 sq feet & it went up & was roofed basically in just under a month & a half!

I did plumb for A/C, but I wanted to live here the first summer to determine whether or not I needed it. Last summer was a typical La Paz summer with daily temperatures in the 100-105 range. My interior temps have never exceeded 82 & for me, it's totally comfortable & livable just using a ceiling fan. The lowest it's gotten inside is 68 & on the rare occasions I feel cold, I just add a sweater.

Now I gotta come up with a way to cover 3 A/C openings! I'm still debating on putting an A/C unit in the MBR to take care of the high humidity days.
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Old 05-31-09, 06:20 AM   #2
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Ever since you sent us those pictures sometime back we've been thinking about those blocks, but decided against them as our builder has no experience building with foam. In our remote location, housing and feeding a crew that had experience would probably outweigh the savings in labor. Plus we don't have the heat issues you do.

But...after seeing it built, if your builder had absolutely no experience with the foam blocks would you still consider using them, or is it something that needs an experienced crew and cement trucks capable of making continuous concrete pours?
Old 05-31-09, 12:09 PM   #3
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Wooo, you may not have the need for A/C that La Paz does, but what about heating? How cold does it get there? When it's been in the 50's here at night, the coldest it's gotten inside is 68, which eliminates my need for any supplemental heat source...beyond a sweater & fuzzy slippers! I noticed a huge difference from my previous constructions before my place was even sealed with door & windows! It was MUCH cooler inside! The workers kept commenting on how "fresh" it was inside!

In my case, I "imported" my builder from Hermosillo because he DID have extensive experience building with foam blocks; the local crew here did not have any experience at all. FANOSA has a training CD & in my case, FANOSA came to my site for the first day of block installation, approved the placement of the rebar & prep work, they showed the video on a laptop, explained, answered questions & came back a day or two later to inspect the work being performed.

Possibilities:

1. You & Oladulce are both pretty smart cookies!! You could come to La Paz, spend a day being trained by FANOSA, get a copy of the video & take it back to train your builder & workers.

2. You could send/bring your builder to La Paz for training as well.

3. You could ask FANOSA if they have someone who could make a 2-3 day to your site to get your workers trained & get the project started right. Or it's possible that FANOSA may be able to recommend a trained/experienced person closer to your site.

If you don't have the extreme temperatures that La Paz does, the benefits for cooling/heating may not carry as much importance as they did to me. My #1 reason for choosing them was the heat here, my #2 reason was reduced cost in construction time to get the shell up & enclosed, which equates to an appreciably shorter period of time in paying labor & Seguro Social for a large number of workers. #3 was the obvious savings in electricity by reducing or eliminating the need for A/C over the long haul.

I opted to use pumper trucks for my footings/foundation/floors because they're readily available here, the consistency of the mix is regulated & controlled for all the deliveries & in the long run, the cost was lower because I paid much less for the trucks than I would have for the workers to mix it mixer-by-mixer on-site. What would have taken weeks to do manually was accomplished in approximately 4 hours each for the floor & roof. All the cement that went inside the walls was mixed on-site load by load, as was the interior/exterior plaster.

The only downside for me is the foam is so lightweight that it blows everywhere in the wind. Whole pieces need to be weighted down until they're installed, but what drove me crazy was all the little white "bubbles" & small pieces all over the landscape from the workers cutting sections as required. I'd be telling the workers to go retrieve small pieces which had blown onto adjacent properties & they'd try to convince me "es no neccesito, cinco mas minutos es no mas aqui"! Yeah in 5 more minutes it'd be somewhere else, but it'd still be littering the landscape SOMEWHERE! I always made sure I won this battle....the bubbles are impossible to keep contained, but larger pieces were retrieved.

This stuff is all interlocking (kinda like leggos) & stagger stacked like cement block is. The corners are tied together with rebar & cement columns & the rebar throughout interior & exterior walls were well-anchored into the original floor/foundation pour.

To me, the interlocking cement core throughout also increased the structural integrity over typical cement block construction. While my perimeter wall is cement block const, I had the section of the perimeter wall which is the back wall to house my exterior LP generator made of foam rather than cement block to help reduce sound....I also had the side walls, roof made of foam. And I had the floor of that area raised to achieve an easier-to-access height by stacking two of the foam roofing blocks on top of each other & then plastered.

It's just something to think about, I can fully understand that La Paz temps make it more of a deciding factor than it might at your location.
Old 05-31-09, 06:42 PM   #4
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Thank you for the info.,

Even though we don't have the extreme temps you do, I still think it may make sense. Our guest house (block with foam/cement roof) gets down to about 60 in the winter and about 82 to 85 during summer days, but it usually cools of nicely at night. I'm definitely going to look into foam block more though and make some price comparisons.

Our neighbor is building out of the Tri-D panels and his construction costs are through the roof, so we pretty much lost interest in foam. The blocks seem much simpler though. The builder we are using is smart guy and I'm sure he's at least heard of it.

As far as temp extremes, our summers rarely stay above 90 for any length of time (we've done fine without AC), and we really don't have many of the cold northerlies like you do. I've been comparing the weather for the last few years and it seems our summers are much cooler and the winters a bit warmer. It would be nice to get the house built in less than a year + though and not be miserable when it is hot and humid, or cold.

Otra Vez, Muchas Gracias for the info
Old 06-01-09, 05:59 AM   #5
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Great thread Legs and I look forward to your reports of how it holds up against the coming summer.

I talked to a guy on a recent flight from Tijuana - Mexico City who built a 4 BR place down your way with cement block and who shared with me that his summer A/C bills were killing him the first two years. He had heard of the foam style construction you used and even considered selling his place to build with the foam but he really liked his location and view. What he did instead was to hire a contractor who dropped his high ceilings down a foot, insulate the space created and cover the house with thick sheets of foam that were plastered over. He said that he only runs his A/C now to cool the place down a bit after being gone for several days with the house closed up. When I asked him what his normal interior temps were he told me that they never go over the mid 80's on the hottest days and usually closer to 80 for most of the summer.

Might be an option for some who likes your foam construction method but have already built...
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Old 06-01-09, 06:35 AM   #6
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Having insulation in the roof makes a huge difference. The picture below is how they did ours. This is the garage,

On the left you can see a stack of the foam blocks that are poured into the roof.

If we do use block for the main house we'll put the foam between floors and on the roof. The foam in the roof makes a huge difference over solid concrete, but I'm sure not nearly as insulating as the foam blocks.
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Old 06-01-09, 08:34 AM   #7
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Wooo, that foam ceiling technique is how all but the low-cost government subsidized housing is done here. All of my roofs have been done that way. It accomplishes two things, it helps insulate against heat & it lightens the weight load on the structure. Also, it's appreciably cheaper than cement!!

I've attached a pic showing a small cut-away section of the interior....workers forgot to block off the area for the doggie door! They had to cut through the concrete cores, but all worked out in the end & we eventually did get the doggie door I made installed, much to the relief of my dogs & me!
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Old 06-02-09, 05:37 AM   #8
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

WoW, concrete from heaven I wish we had hose from the sky to pour our roof!
Old 06-02-09, 06:39 AM   #9
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Old 06-02-09, 07:42 PM   #10
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

This thread is fantastic! Thank you for posting it. At one time in my life I wanted a straw bale house. Never did it though.

Now my son is wondering if he can build a house like you've got out of styrofoam ice chests. I'm not sure if he's kidding or not....
Old 06-02-09, 08:06 PM   #11
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

How old is your son? Please tell him to not try this at home! Somehow I think the melting ice & the workers checking all the ice chests for beer might not make for the most stable structure! ;)

There IS a round house in Centenario that was make out of bales of hay & plastered, I saw it long ago during construction....from afar, never went inside.
Old 08-03-09, 03:23 PM   #12
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

I visited a construction site for a 7 story condo in La Paz last fall made out of the high density polystyrene panels with a concrete core. The walls are rated R-22 and can withstand a force 5 hurricane because the entire wall is concrete with no foam between cores.
I was quoted $18,000 for the panels and the hardware that connects them for a 2,400 Sq. Ft. house with 10' high walls and that included the roof. Just add rebar and labor and call the pump truck.
Old 08-03-09, 09:01 PM   #13
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

I have heard more and more folks talk about this construction method as well as a few hybrids of it lately. I am curious to see how it really holds up over time. Sounds really promising...
Old 09-09-09, 02:10 PM   #14
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

BG, here's the link www.quadlock.com
Old 09-16-09, 12:12 PM   #15
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Legs, any more progress pics? We would all like to see the finished project. I am visiting La Paz next month to interview builders for my house project in Los Barriles. Can you share any contact information for contractors that might be interested?
Old 09-16-09, 12:45 PM   #16
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

******,

Long legs, yes! Nice feet too!


Sorry couldn't resist.


Ken

Last edited by Marty Cortez; 09-16-09 at 01:30 PM. Reason: omit name by request
Old 09-16-09, 01:12 PM   #17
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Quote:
Originally Posted by tripledigitken
******,

Long legs, yes! Nice feet too!

Sorry couldn't resist.

Ken
Pssst; perhaps you missed it.
http://www.talkbaja.com/showthread.php?t=688
Old 09-16-09, 02:08 PM   #18
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty Cortez
Pssst; perhaps you missed it.
http://www.talkbaja.com/showthread.php?t=688
Longlegs,

My bad for not using your "handle". Sorry for that.

I'll go back to lurking for awhile.


Ken
Old 09-16-09, 07:32 PM   #19
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Default Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Quote:
Originally Posted by tripledigitken
Longlegs,

My bad for not using your "handle". Sorry for that.

I'll go back to lurking for awhile.


Ken
Ken, that's okay, you're forgiven! You'd obviously missed my "rabid" post earlier, so you had no way of knowing my feelings & reasons. You're cheating since we've met & you have first-hand knowledge! No reason to skulk off into lurking mode. I took it as the compliment I know you intended!

Marty, thank you for "changing the names to protect the innocent"!

Ciscokid, I do have more pics & will try to get organized & back in the posting mode....my posting to this thread got cut off rather abruptly because I got sick with e-coli & was running about 50% power for at least 2 months....then I spent a LOT of time researching the IRS reporting of fideicomisos as a trust & filling out reams of paperwork to satisfy that <intensive effort of futility> requirement (just got all 50+ pages of that in the mail yesterday!)....THEN that process was temporarily interrupted by hurricane Jimena preparation, so give me a couple days to get back into pic posting mode. Life sometimes thas a way of taking over the best-laid plans! If you have anything specific you're interested in seeing, feel free to ask & I'm very likely to have pics of it! Otherwise I'll try to post in chronological order as construction progressed.
Old 09-16-09, 07:51 PM   #20
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Thumbs up Re: My TOP Pick in Construction Material

Quote:
Originally Posted by longlegsinlapaz
...If you have anything specific you're interested in seeing, feel free to ask & I'm very likely to have pics...
¡Órale; pues!







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